Washington Redskin Money

[49erkezarguy]

I don't get it as to how Washington is able to come up with tons and tons of money every year and why they don't go through cap hell as the 49ers had to. Anybody out there with answers to this question?

[Mace Windu]

I have been wondering the same thing.

Me too. I live in the Washington DC area and I can't wait for them to crash and burn so I can talk smack to all the people who have been talking smack to me about the niners the last couple of years.

[DenverNiner]

With the success (or lack there of) the Redskins have been having all their high paid FA's, I hope it stays their little secret. :ph34r:

I have wondered the same thing. Only a guess but I wonder if the contracts are loaded up on the front end or something so that when they let a player go after year 2 or 3 the cap hit is minimal. I'm no capologist. I thought it was extremely fishy last year when Lavar Arrington bought out his own contract (or game money back; whatever) so that the Redskins would let him go. I'm no TO but I thought I smelled a rat when that went down.:money:

[Batman]

Daniel Snyder pays a huge tax every year for the cap penalties he suffered from the previous year(s). Kind of like in Madden, you can just trade everyone away and clear the cap penalties. Essentially, this is what Snyder does because he has that kind of money.

[BrentJones84]

I don't get it as to how Washington is able to come up with tons and tons of money every year and why they don't go through cap hell as the 49ers had to. Anybody out there with answers to this question?

Because while they are busy signing a few guys to big contracts, they also quietly let their own FAs walk away, or otherwise get rid of players.

An over simplified example:
Last year they signed Andre Carter to their defense.
But they let Lavar Arlington and Walt Harris walk away without an offer.

They signed Randel El and Lloyd to their offense, but they traded Ramsey and his big salary to the Jets.

For every addition, there is a subtraction.

Which is why despite all the hype, they can't put together winning seasons.

[Denver9erfan]

Because while they are busy signing a few guys to big contracts, they also quietly let their own FAs walk away, or otherwise get rid of players.

An over simplified example:
Last year they signed Andre Carter to their defense.
But they let Lavar Arlington and Walt Harris walk away without an offer.

They signed Randel El and Lloyd to their offense, but they traded Ramsey and his big salary to the Jets.

For every addition, there is a subtraction.

Which is why despite all the hype, they can't put together winning seasons.


It's also because the size of the contracts, that are reported, are really funny money they have no intention of paying. They have moderate upfront bonuses, low salaries, and the back ends are loaded with unguaranteed money. If they have to cut them the only hit they get is from the prorated signing bonuses. It works for awhile because it minimizes the dead money, but it still creates dead money and as much as they're doing it... it will catch up to them if they continue doing this. Remember, they've really only been doing this for the last 3, maybe 4 years, so they've been able to get away with it.

[steadypimpin]

they are gonna be hurting this year. I know it for a fact. We wont see them doing anything big in free agency.

[Ace Matherton]

Daniel Snyder pays a huge tax every year for the cap penalties he suffered from the previous year(s). Kind of like in Madden, you can just trade everyone away and clear the cap penalties. Essentially, this is what Snyder does because he has that kind of money.
There is no cap tax, and its nothing like Madden.
They front load contracts with large bonuses so after 2 years the cap hit when they cut or release a player is minimal or they sign guys to large contracts never intended to be paid with the majority of the cap money comming in the early years. If you have an owner with a huge bankroll who is not concerned with cash flow its a possibility. Snyder's situation is for the most part unique as far as NFl owners go.

[BrentJones84]

It's also because the size of the contracts, that are reported, are really funny money they have no intention of paying. They have moderate upfront bonuses, low salaries, and the back ends are loaded with unguaranteed money. If they have to cut them the only hit they get is from the prorated signing bonuses. It works for awhile because it minimizes the dead money, but it still creates dead money and as much as they're doing it... it will catch up to them if they continue doing this. Remember, they've really only been doing this for the last 3, maybe 4 years, so they've been able to get away with it.

True, many contracts are back loaded.

Dead money is only created when pro-rated signing bonuses are acelerated when a player is released prior to the end of a contract.

Unpaid salaries, and un-earned bonuses don't create dead money, so back loaded contracts don't hurt their cap.

[TheWiz]

The Redskins don't have as much money as people think they do. In fact, they're about one of the worst cap-managed teams in the league and they only have the appearance of signing big names to mega-deals.

- The Redskins care little for draft picks. They switch and trade and bargain down to about 1 impact pick per year and that's it. It's of their mind that college players are gambles whereas veterans you know how they play in the professional ranks. If you can trade a 3rd rounder for a veteran instead of possibly a rookie flop, you do it. As a result, they spend less money on rookies.

- They notoriously backload deals of mediocre to low level free agents. You get a moderate bonus and cheap salaries and then the last 2 or 3 years you're due to make 7 times your average base salary. The contract looks huge, it's not. You'll be cut the second that first big salary comes up. The average salary sports writers follow make it look like you made 4M or 5M per year when it was more like 2M. Meanwhile WAS tells you it's a temporary deal and they'll give you a big extension when that big salary year comes up once you earn your keep.

- They front load and side load the big name deals. For example, you pay a player like Randle-El a solid salary but give him a pittance for a signing bonus so you can sign him today for only 1.2M on the cap. However, you guarantee a massive bonus and pay structure for years 2 and 3. You get him now and you pay him later and worry about it then. This is called side-loading, basically throwing the bulk of the cash into the middle of a deal so you get the player at a discount today. Meanwhile WAS is also a team that doesn't believe in cap space. They front load any deals possible to open space tomorrow. If they can increase a new salary and have it cheaper in year 3, they'll do it. This way they can get players who want a lot in year 1 to come around and then in year 3 the player finds themselves making a minimal salary but they can't complain because they made a ton of money the first 2 seasons.

But if WAS is signing guys to a variety of deals and often cutting or letting them go after 3 or 4 years, why aren't they getting bitten with dead money? They ARE! The problem is that even though WAS picks up an extra 5M or 6M in dead cash clearing out their deals, the cap rises by 7M. Then they realize they will have another 7M in space next year so they get players to sign side-loaded deals while pushing some dead money into the future as well. SAlary cap increases are helping them immensely.

This won't last long though.

Last time I checked, they're a mere 500k under the 2007 salary cap.

1) They've also got quite a few FAs that are worth keeping but they can't afford. They'll be losing some solid, supporting players on that team and need to step a tier lower to find replacements.

2) The new league structure, the CAMS, will severely hurt WAS. As a team that regularly spends a lot in bonuses and front loaded contracts, they will be a team hurt under this new mechanism that should reduce the size of the cap increases they will get in the future.

3) They really, really missed out last year. Lloyd has a 4M/year deal with a lot of guarantees and the locker room hates him. Archuleta signed the biggest deal to date for a S packed with 15M in guarantees and WAS seems ready to cut him at a huge cap loss. About the only salvation they will have is that they might save money by moving Brunell and Portis while getting a solid draft pick for Portis in the deal.

4) They will need to restructure en masse. That means cutting salaries to clear cap room but adding debt to the future.

WAS should be a dismal team next year. Defensively they lack playmakers on the DL and at LB. They are likely going to lose Springs at CB and they should be losing several of those LBs. Offensively they will have a young QB and need their backup RB to become a starter behind an OL that is prepped to lose at least 2 starters. WAS is going to take a big step backwards next year and it will take some drafting magic to get players who can fill the roles.

[Ace Matherton]

Ehhh ya what he said!

[Denver9erfan]

True, many contracts are back loaded.

Dead money is only created when pro-rated signing bonuses are acelerated when a player is released prior to the end of a contract.

Unpaid salaries, and un-earned bonuses don't create dead money, so back loaded contracts don't hurt their cap.

Right, that's why I'm saying it minimizes the dead money... but they still do pay signing bonuses that will create dead money, especially when they keep doing it every offseason. Even if they're not blockbuster signing bonuses, all of them will begin to add up.

[sandiegojoe]

Thanks Wiz, The redskins look like a bunch of screwups.

Although, there is something to be said about the concept of trading draft picks for veterans, and then not having to worry about the cost of rookie contracts. As a strategy there is some fiscal logic to it and it creates more of an immediate impact on your roster.

The only catch is that if you are going to give away draft picks, you better make sure the player is gonna produce. They blew it big time with Lloyd. Seems like they based it all on his highlight reel rather than really critiquing the guy. (not that I'm complaining :D)

[49ERSFAN$LIFE]

well i figured snyder what he does is when he signs someone "special" and pays them a lot of money he will re-structure somone elses contract to where they get paid 2 mil for one year and then another 2 mil the next year and then like 7 mil the 3rd year, instead of 4mil 4mil 3 mil so thats how i believe he does it

[TheWiz]

Just because I felt the need to say I told you so for once...


This won't last long though.

Last time I checked, they're a mere 500k under the 2007 salary cap.

.....

4) They will need to restructure en masse. That means cutting salaries to clear cap room but adding debt to the future.

WAS should be a dismal team next year. Defensively they lack playmakers on the DL and at LB. They are likely going to lose Springs at CB and they should be losing several of those LBs. Offensively they will have a young QB and need their backup RB to become a starter behind an OL that is prepped to lose at least 2 starters. WAS is going to take a big step backwards next year and it will take some drafting magic to get players who can fill the roles.

As of today it was released that they have restructured the WHOPPING 1.3M base salary of James Thrash, a WR well past his prime. It cleared a massive 380k for a player who is well past his prime and pushed more debt into next season for WAS. They're also going to be dipping into the salaries for QB Brunell, CB Springs, OT Jansen, DE Wynn, and DE Daniels. Basically every large salaried player who isn't guaranteed every penny and they're likely to jetison otherwise.

This team has finally gotten desparate. They're now I believe over the cap by several million after playing performance incentives spilled over from '06 into the '07 salary cap. They're dipping into the salaries of players who likely should be cut within the next season or two to create cap room now. This just means that not only will they get slammed by contracts like Lloyd and Carter but the extra money they're shoving into '08 will hurt even more.

[MtzNinersfan]

Haha well i was also wondering why wasington could keep signing all these players but not after reading that post.