Brown vs Orakpo?

[TheWileyVet]

Earlier Scot McCloughan came out and said the Niners couldn't afford to pass up a 'can't miss' pass rusher at 10.

While this may be just b.s. pumped to the media, because who would pass on a 'can't miss' PR? But what happens if that is the actual plan?



Let's end the debate once and for all.

Who do you got? Everette Brown or Brian Orakpo??

[Nelson]

Brown, much more raw natural talent (more explosive, faster, etc) and, IMO, he has more/better PR moves than Orakpo does.

I think he's solid against the run also. I think thats a weakness in Orakpo but to be honest I'd be happy with either.

[Benji]

Orakpo hands down

[TheWileyVet]

I picked Brown.

I'm not expert, but from what I've seen I like Everette more. Rak is a monster but so was V.Gholston

[Zhero06]

Brown, much more raw natural talent (more explosive, faster, etc) and, IMO, he has more/better PR moves than Orakpo does.

[beasley for pres]

I think they're both solid players

[OsBoogie]

Brown seems to have more upside as a 34 OLB to me... but Orakpo also seems like the safer pick

[TheWileyVet]

Brown, much more raw natural talent (more explosive, faster, etc) and, IMO, he has more/better PR moves than Orakpo does.

TBC needs to learn how to spin move like Brown!

And how not to suck :headhurts:

[OsBoogie]

TBC needs to learn how to spin move like Brown!

And how not to suck :headhurts:

TBC needs to learn how to subway like Jared...

http://innovationgonewrong.files.wordpress.com/2008/06/jared-pants.jpg

[ManCans]

Just FYI, Mayock has dropped Brown down to his 5th ranked OLB in this draft.

http://www.nfl.com/nflnetwork/story?id=09000d5d80dff358&template=with-video-with-comments&confirm=true

[GoreScores]

Just FYI, Mayock has dropped Brown down to his 5th ranked OLB in this draft.

http://www.nfl.com/nflnetwork/story?id=09000d5d80dff358&template=with-video-with-comments&confirm=true

Well, he's wrong....pwned :drive:

[Tovey21]

I like Orakpo at 4-3 end much more than 3-4 OLb. I think Orakpo would struggle making the transition to 3-4 OLB like Vernon Gholston.

[ArmchairGM]

It kind of reminds me of the 2005 draft. I see Brown as DeMarcus Ware and Orakpo as Shawn Merriman. Both could turn out to be good players.

[49ersRus]

Brian Cushing! He can play every down, on every LB position in the 34 or 43, and he is under rated as a PR.

Worst case, we use him at SAM instead of WILL.

[Nelson]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vyX5mfb-eaA

**** me!! He is just flat out awsome. He has got so many moves and is so quick of the snap. I'd love to see his 40 time.

If we dont get Raji at 10 I want Brown.

[WehaveVD]

It kind of reminds me of the 2005 draft. I see Brown as DeMarcus Ware and Orakpo as Shawn Merriman. Both could turn out to be good players.


Great post.....I think you're really on to something here!!! I don't think we could go wrong with either guy....As for the Vernon Gholston/Brian Orakpo comparisons I think they are a bit of an over-generalization just because both guys are gym rats....Rak is far more explosive on the field and a way better tackler...

[xcfan]

IMO, both these guys are dangerously close to having the hips of gholston (not a good thing).

all you might get is a guy who's a liability against the run and in olb coverage, and who MIGHT do ok rushing the passer against OTs who weigh 50 lbs more than them and have nfl feet -- that's a big jump in OT quality compared to their average weekly opponent in college.

this whole class of pass rushers (de/olb tweeners) scares me.
if you're a scout, you better know how to distinguish between the gholston's and the demarcus ware's.
so many of these guys have great measurables, but so few can actually succeed at DE. i'm glad i don't have to draft one.
i think the only clue you have is, can the player maintain balance and agility while under duress? don't be deceived by point A to point B speed, as they were with gholston.

[Pnkpnther16]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fGUc3UL64f0

Was about to post this, benches 515 and squats almost 700 AND is quick. WOW!

[49ersforlife5x]

I wouldn't call either "can't miss". I think they're both busts in the making.

I think we'd be better to go after Peppers or Suggs.

[Nelson]

I wouldn't call either "can't miss". I think they're both busts in the making.I think we'd be better to go after Peppers or Suggs.

:slap:

[pickelweasel]

I wouldn't call either "can't miss". I think they're both busts in the making.

I think we'd be better to go after Peppers or Suggs.

Ya you should really stop doing that. Just stick to what you're good at. Basket weaving maybe.

[TheWileyVet]

Ya you should really stop doing that. Just stick to what you're good at. Basket weaving maybe.

mean haha


This poll is really split right down the middle :telephone:

[Coldrain85]

I wouldn't call either "can't miss". I think they're both busts in the making.

I think we'd be better to go after Peppers or Suggs.

Judging by how it's gone down in the past with defensive linemen in the draft there's about a 50% chance that you're right. DL is the most risky position to take with a high draft pick since it has the smallest chance of paying off. There are always a lot of physically gifted defensive linemen out there who look good in college because they can get by on strength alone. Then they get to the NFL and get exposed because of their lack of technique. They never bothered to learn it well because they didn't need it as much. A player with average strength and great technique will go far, but it's not true the other way around.

That said, there's a reason why proven defensive linemen get big money in free agency. I tend to agree with you in that we look for an edge rusher in free agency who can step in right away and get to the QB. But then again, I trust that Sing knows what to look for when critiquing the skills of a pass rushing defensive lineman. If he decides to go that way in the draft I'm all for it.

I say we build the DL via free agency as well as a draft pick from round 2 or 3, and we get Malcolm Jenkins with the #10 pick.

[TheWileyVet]

Judging by how it's gone down in the past with defensive linemen in the draft there's about a 50% chance that you're right. DL is the most risky position to take with a high draft pick since it has the smallest chance of paying off. There are always a lot of physically gifted defensive linemen out there who look good in college because they can get by on strength alone. Then they get to the NFL and get exposed because of their lack of technique. They never bothered to learn it well because they didn't need it as much. A player with average strength and great technique will go far, but it's not true the other way around.

This is why I'd rather have Brown. In what I've seen, Everette Brown seems to have better technique and PR moves than Orakpo.

Orakpo may be a physical monster but the NFL is a man's league and he won't be able to get by just on muscles. Not saying Rak won't succeed, I just like the fact that Brown already has some good technique.

[ManCans]

I think Aaron Maybin will go before Everette Brown.

[The OLD Cookie Monster]

I think Aaron Maybin will go before Everette Brown.

Manny Lawson 2.0? I don't think so.

[ftn49]

Earlier Scot McCloughan came out and said the Niners couldn't afford to pass up 'can't miss' pass rusher at 10.

While this may be just b.s. pumped to the media, because who would pass on a 'can't miss' PR? But what happens if that is the actual plan?



Let's end the debate once and for all.

Who do you got? Everette Brown or Brian Orakpo??

I voted Brown, but thats not really what McCloughan said at all, or at least not the conotation I think your trying to imply.

He said IF there was a cant miss pass rusher when we picked we would be fools not to take them or something along those lines. Not that there is a "can't miss" prospect or we will take a pass rusher at 10 no matter what.

[ManCans]

Manny Lawson 2.0? I don't think so.Not even close.:slap:

[LottdownD42]

Both brown and Ork have nice abilities.. neither have great 'pass rush' moves.. they often use speed rushes or Browns spin move that hes been successful with.. it'd be interesting to see how they do setting someone up out of a 2-point stance instead of blowing by out of a 3!

I chose neither.. I like Clint Sintim and Larry English! Clint is the complete package, has all the experience in the 3-4 and can play all the spots! English, someone compared him to Ware.. must be listening to Mcshay too much or something.. i think his game is a lot more like Shawn Phillps in SD! Regardless he's very good at setting tackles up and keeping them guessing.. was constantly doubled by TE and chiped by RBs and still produced!

[Max_Power]

Well, he's wrong....pwned :drive:

Hahahaha. I hope you aren't serious and believe you know more than Mayock.

[Max_Power]

Brian Cushing! He can play every down, on every LB position in the 34 or 43, and he is under rated as a PR.

Worst case, we use him at SAM instead of WILL.

Umm...no. One of the most injury plagued players in the draft and he has no true position. I'll pass. I'd even pass in the second. Hell, I would probably even pass in the third too.

Don't get me wrong, he seems like a good kid and all, I just think he'll fail in the NFL.

[49ersforlife5x]

It kind of reminds me of the 2005 draft. I see Brown as DeMarcus Ware and Orakpo as Shawn Merriman. Both could turn out to be good players.

I think you're out to lunch.

I, personally, don't like either of them. I think Orakpo is too inconsistant. And I don't think Brown has the brain... Seriously, I have doubts about his character and his ability to adapt to the NFL.

[The OLD Cookie Monster]

I think you're out to lunch.

I, personally, don't like either of them. I think Orakpo is too inconsistant. And I don't think Brown has the brain... Seriously, I have doubts about his character and his ability to adapt to the NFL.

Well it's customary that you absolutely make a fool of yourself regarding the draft, so it may be a safe bet that they'll both turn out to be great players.

[TheWileyVet]

I voted Brown, but thats not really what McCloughan said at all, or at least not the conotation I think your trying to imply.

He said IF there was a cant miss pass rusher when we picked we would be fools not to take them or something along those lines. Not that there is a "can't miss" prospect or we will take a pass rusher at 10 no matter what.

That's why I said this

Earlier Scot McCloughan came out and said the Niners couldn't afford to pass up 'can't miss' pass rusher at 10.

While this may be just b.s. pumped to the media, because who would pass on a 'can't miss' PR? But what happens if that is the actual plan?



Let's end the debate once and for all.

Who do you got? Everette Brown or Brian Orakpo??


I guess I should of put 'if' in bold or italics. Or maybe paraphrased Scotty Mac more closely. :sfhelmet:

[Hobbes2d]

Not even close.:slap:

You're right Maybin is worse. :slap:

[49ersRus]

Umm...no. One of the most injury plagued players in the draft and he has no true position. I'll pass. I'd even pass in the second. Hell, I would probably even pass in the third too.

Don't get me wrong, he seems like a good kid and all, I just think he'll fail in the NFL.

I am probably the only one on this planet who wants Cushing for us at #10. I recognize that. I just don't care, lol.

That being said, you don't think Harralson is better then Cushing do you? Because I think Cushing is >>> Haralson in all phases of football. He is not just a one dimensional PR specialist. He can drop back in zone, play the zone blitz, play sideline to sideline against the run and is a brutal tackler. His versatility, of which you decry, will enable us to be a true 34 defense. Please tell me your not drinking the cool aide (Although I think I know the answer)?

Yeah, he has had injuries in the past. Its because he plays with reckless abandon. Those are the kinds of guys we want on our team. He has fought through them, and he is healthy now. He will pass his physical. No problems.

If he is there at #10, I hope we at lease consider him.

[Adrian]

I think you're out to lunch.

I, personally, don't like either of them. I think Orakpo is too inconsistant. And I don't think Brown has the brain... Seriously, I have doubts about his character and his ability to adapt to the NFL. Brown doesnt have the brain or character?do you even know anything about the guy? He has never gotten into any police or academic trouble at florida state whatsoever and keeps to himself and is a soft spoken guy. talkin out of your *** lately?.

[Nelson]

Well it's customary that you absolutely make a fool of yourself regarding the draft, so it may be a safe bet that they'll both turn out to be great players.

Exactly . Rep!

[49ersforlife5x]

Brown doesnt have the brain or character?do you even know anything about the guy? He has never gotten into any police or academic trouble at florida state whatsoever and keeps to himself and is a soft spoken guy. talkin out of your *** lately?.

Dude, that guy's only motivating factor is money. He doesn't care if he ever nets one sack in the NFL.

He was quoted as saying, "I won't enter the draft unless I know I can go top 10"... The next day he announced he would declare.. Someone told him he had a legit shot to go in the top 10... What's the difference between top 10, and mid-teens? Money! That's what it always boils down to!

What does that tell you? That paycheck is all that matters to him. He could have done his senior year, and he still would have gone high. He's, what, 20 years old? What difference is one more year, and finishing your education, going to make? If you're legitimately talented, you'll get drafted high, and you'll have every opportunity to make it in the pros.

Glenn Dorsey would have gone top 5 if he declared as a junior. He stayed, had a down year, and still went top 5! So why **** on your education? Obviously, Brown doesn't care about anything like that. Every analyst will agree, declaring as a junior is rarely a smart move. That extra year of maturing and seasoning is really valuable.

If you're concerned about getting hurt as a senior, then perhaps you're playing in the wrong sport. In a day and age where character has become every bit as important as actual talent, guys shouldn't be declaring as juniors.
It casts way too many doubts about intrinsic motivation.

[SING'S BOXERS]

Dude, that guy's only motivating factor is money. He doesn't care if he ever nets one sack in the NFL.

He was quoted as saying, "I won't enter the draft unless I know I can go top 10"... The next day he announced he would declare.. Someone told him he had a legit shot to go in the top 10... What's the difference between top 10, and mid-teens? Money! That's what it always boils down to!

What does that tell you? That paycheck is all that matters to him. He could have done his senior year, and he still would have gone high. He's, what, 20 years old? What difference is one more year, and finishing your education, going to make? If you're legitimately talented, you'll get drafted high, and you'll have every opportunity to make it in the pros.

Glenn Dorsey would have gone top 5 if he declared as a junior. He stayed, had a down year, and still went top 5! So why **** on your education? Obviously, Brown doesn't care about anything like that. Every analyst will agree, declaring as a junior is rarely a smart move. That extra year of maturing and seasoning is really valuable.

If you're concerned about getting hurt as a senior, then perhaps you're playing in the wrong sport. In a day and age where character has become every bit as important as actual talent, guys shouldn't be declaring as juniors.
It casts way too many doubts about intrinsic motivation.

so by your logic, 90% of players entering the draft have character issues? B/c most players in the draft aren't seniors....

[Nelson]

so by your logic, 90% of players entering the draft have character issues? B/c most players in the draft aren't seniors....

add to that that all juniors are declaring just for the money.

[The OLD Cookie Monster]

so by your logic, 90% of players entering the draft have character issues? B/c most players in the draft aren't seniors....

:falldownlaugh: Yes they are.

[Adrian]

um..if you're a junior and are already predicted to be a top 10 pick...wouldnt you declare for the draft too?..this has been done hundreds of times and for the most part..its worked out pretty well. i guess you can say that every junior thats ever declared that was ever predicted to go top 10 is all about the money. if any junior thats projected top 10 in the draft doesnt declare...they are fools imo. They risk way too much coming back for their senior year with either injury or a dissappointing season stat wise. Very rarely does a projected top 10 junior go back for their senior year and improve their stock. Just ask Matt leinart how everything worked out for him. He went from probable #1 pick to a number 10 or 11 pick by coming back, losing the title game, and having better qbs rise above him in the draft because they outplayed him that year.

[SING'S BOXERS]

:falldownlaugh: Yes they are.

........there's always a ton of juniors who come out for the draft.

[Adrian]

........there's always a ton of juniors who come out for the draft.

yea but not 90% of players in the draft. Most juniors that declare are projected in the first 3 rounds. If you're a junior and dont project in the first three rounds(a la glenn coffee..whos making a big mistake by the way)..you better stay in school.

[The OLD Cookie Monster]

........there's always a ton of juniors who come out for the draft.

:laugh: Not the majority, let alone 90 percent.

[The OLD Cookie Monster]

Yeah you can tell Mario Williams has awful character because he came out a year early. And Larry Fitzgerald is clearly the biggest thug in the NFL, he came out TWO years early!! That means he's twice as bad as anyone else in the NFL!

What about that mother ****er Paul Kruger? He doesn't even care about football because before going to Utah he went on a church mission, now he's leaving school early?

Obviously he doesn't have heart and only wants more money so he can tive more.

[Gof the Gij]

Yeah you can tell Mario Williams has awful character because he came out a year early. And Larry Fitzgerald is clearly the biggest thug in the NFL, he came out TWO years early!! That means he's twice as bad as anyone else in the NFL!

[txboi]

I said Orakpo cause I've seen him play more so Im going by what I've seen. That video posted of Brown looked good too though, now I know its just a highlight video so you cant go by that, but Does Brown have any power moves he seemed to just use his raw speed and nothing else.

[WhistlingMtn]

I said Orakpo cause I've seen him play more so Im going by what I've seen. That video posted of Brown looked good too though, now I know its just a highlight video so you cant go by that, but Does Brown have any power moves he seemed to just use his raw speed and nothing else.

From what I've seen he has several moves, including a bull-rush, spin-move, speed move, but I think he tends to favor the latter because it was his biggest advantage in college. I think he'll be the better 3-4 OLB.

Orakpo probably the better all-round defender, and while he could play in a 3-4, probably best in a 4-3. I wouldn't be upset with either, but neither are a sure thing. If they were they'd go in the top 5.

[txboi]

From what I've seen he has several moves, including a bull-rush, spin-move, speed move, but I think he tends to favor the latter because it was his biggest advantage in college. I think he'll be the better 3-4 OLB.

Orakpo probably the better all-round defender, and while he could play in a 3-4, probably best in a 4-3. I wouldn't be upset with either, but neither are a sure thing. If they were they'd go in the top 5.

Like I said I haven't watched him so I homered out and went with Orakpo. lol

[SangerDude]

I am just glad that I dont have to actually PICK any of these players...they have the attributes that make GM's drool! Either can suck it big time too! How they translate to the next level....well that is why we are fans and why the game is played! LOL!

I have seen Larry English thrown out there a lot too, here is a link to his highlights...I could see him in a 3-4 backpeddling uphill or running downhill toward the quarterback!



http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3Ad0Famkaas

[49ersforlife5x]

:falldownlaugh: Yes they are.

Yeah, refresh my memory, how many juniors were granted eligibility for this draft? Like sixty? Something like that... And there's what, 250+ draft selections....


And, for the record, I do question character on anyone who declares early. I've said it many times before, and most football analysts (guys who actually know anything about football) second that opinion.

That whole,"leaving school early because you think you can get a better paycheck", mentality is actually sickening.

Look at our recent junior picks: Alex Smith (horrible), Vernon Davis (useless), Reggie Smith (has made less noise than crickets)..

Look at Lawrence Timmons, for example; he's been relegated to second string duties and special teams, as opposed to Lamar Woodley, who's become a standout!

Maturity is a big part of being a solid football player. Dumping school early for a paycheck is a scary proposition, because you are looking spending a lot of money on guys who's mentality is very suspect...

I don't like it.. And anyone who has a brain, doesn't like it either. You're talking about guys who are 20 years old! Do they really need that money that badly?

[WehaveVD]

Look at Lawrence Timmons, for example; he's been relegated to second string duties and special teams, as opposed to Lamar Woodley, who's become a standout!

Last time I checked, Lawrence Timmons was a starter and had 25 more tackles than Woodley in the regular season.....If you can determine players ability based on they're years in college you are a better man than I.

[49ersforlife5x]

a lot of them do

and if you're gonna pass on a player who wants money... you're roster is gonna be empty

every single player in the draft wants to be drafted as high as possible

No, they don't! Most financial institutes wouldn't even look at someone who is 20 years old.

When you take a 20 year old kid, and give him that kind of money, knowing that he dropped out of school, that is a recipe for disaster. And good teams know that!

I don't know what it is that you guys don't understand about maturity being important! This whole greedy mentality is what's killing America! And guys like you are just flaunting it!

[BAKNAFEK88]

No, they don't! Most financial institutes wouldn't even look at someone who is 20 years old.

When you take a 20 year old kid, and give him that kind of money, knowing that he dropped out of school, that is a recipe for disaster. And good teams know that!

I don't know what it is that you guys don't understand about maturity being important! This whole greedy mentality is what's killing America! And guys like you are just flaunting it!

It's not being greedy as much as being opportunistic. These guys want ot come out and get the money while it is there. Sometimes players fall a few slots in draft status such as James Laurinitis(however you spell that) or even get hurt before they are able to get drafted like Anthony Poindexter. You can't knock a man for taking advantage of an opportunity while it is there. True, the money at such a young age could be a disaster, but it is all about the surrounding cast that these young guys have. The whole objective of going to school is to get a well paying job. Why is it so stupid to get that job if it is there? Last time I checked, guys can always go back to school to get their degree. It baffles me how someone can have the audacity to sit there and say that someone is stupid for taking millions of dollars if it is there for them.

[49ersforlife5x]

It's not being greedy as much as being opportunistic. These guys want ot come out and get the money while it is there. Sometimes players fall a few slots in draft status such as James Laurinitis(however you spell that) or even get hurt before they are able to get drafted like Anthony Poindexter. You can't knock a man for taking advantage of an opportunity while it is there. True, the money at such a young age could be a disaster, but it is all about the surrounding cast that these young guys have. The whole objective of going to school is to get a well paying job. Why is it so stupid to get that job if it is there? Last time I checked, guys can always go back to school to get their degree. It baffles me how someone can have the audacity to sit there and say that someone is stupid for taking millions of dollars if it is there for them.

What I'm saying is this: Players should not be able to declare as juniors. If you're projected to go high in the draft as a junior, and choose to return for your senior year, your stock will not go down. In fact, it'll probably go up!

[BAKNAFEK88]

What I'm saying is this: Players should not be able to declare as juniors. If you're projected to go high in the draft as a junior, and choose to return for your senior year, your stock will not go down. In fact, it'll probably go up!

My friend, that is not always the case. Look at the two players from Ohio State. James Larinitis was an easy top ten draft pick after his jr year. He had a decent senior year and all of a sudden he is a late first rounder. Look at Brian Robiskie. He had the chance to come out as a jr but stayed and due to inconsistent play from his QB, his stock has fallen. Look at Anthony Poindexter from Virginia. He was a first team All American as a junior. He decided to stay, he tore his knee and now he isn't even in the league. What I am saying is this, if the money is there, go get it. Who knows what next year will bring. Will it bring injury? It is aways possible to go back to school and get your degree after you go get the contract. It is that simple.

As for character issues with underclassmen, I think Mario Williams and Larry FItzgerald are great examples of guys who came out early and proved to be class acts. Someone else posted that earlier and it is a great point.

[thedynasty]

What I'm saying is this: Players should not be able to declare as juniors. If you're projected to go high in the draft as a junior, and choose to return for your senior year, your stock will not go down. In fact, it'll probably go up!


that's false. there are plenty of examples of guys whose stock dropped after staying a year too long.

[BAKNAFEK88]

[QUOTE=49ersforlife5x;2111319]No, they don't!QUOTE]

If you think that there are any players entering the draft that don't want to be drafted as high as possible, you are crazy. It is all about the money for any players in the NFL. :slap::slap:

[TheWileyVet]

Whoaaaa Orakpo takes the lead for the first time in the poll!

[thedynasty]

I like FSU players. In recent memory, only Travis Johnson has been a dissapointment.

Wimbley has regressed since his rookie year.

[SBbound49ers]

I like FSU players. In recent memory, only Travis Johnson has been a dissapointment.

[ManCans]

You're right Maybin is worse. :slap:Might be, might not be. They're still COMPLETELY different types of player. Maybin is a much better pass-rusher than Lawson, and Lawson is much better in space. Maybin has more lower body power and plays with a low center of gravity. Lawson plays long-and-lean, and relies more on his smarts and quickness to make plays. Maybin is better suited as a 4-3 defensive end, and Lawson is better suited as a linebacker.

[Zhero06]

Might be, might not be. They're still COMPLETELY different types of player. Maybin is a much better pass-rusher than Lawson, and Lawson is much better in space. Maybin has more lower body power and plays with a low center of gravity. Lawson plays long-and-lean, and relies more on his smarts and quickness to make plays. Maybin is better suited as a 4-3 defensive end, and Lawson is better suited as a linebacker.

All Maybin did was rely on his speed to get around tackles in college. He showed no other pass rush skills and, as a result, is a very raw prospect. Speed can only get you so far in a league that is dominated by athletic and quick OTs who are very very good with their footwork and hand placement. Maybin has the highest potential to be a bust in the NFL, IMO.

[ManCans]

All Maybin did was rely on his speed to get around tackles in college. He showed no other pass rush skills and, as a result, is a very raw prospect. Speed can only get you so far in a league that is dominated by athletic and quick OTs who are very very good with their footwork and hand placement. Maybin has the highest potential to be a bust in the NFL, IMO.The biggest difference between a casual fan and a football coach is that a football coach will look at how a player plays against the run first, and the pass second. Playing the run is secondary at best to the casual fan, which is why most fans don't know how to evaluate players.

Maybin is a better football player than Brown because he plays the run very well, and is also able to put pressure on the quarterback. Brown is a pass-rushing specialist who is a liablity against the run. Maybin is an every-down player, while Brown is strictly a third-down player.

Maybin is more than just a speed rusher, although that is a very sought-after quality in the NFL. He plays low with leverage which makes it very hard for an offensive tackle to stand him up, and he has long arms with a very effective rip move which prevents tackles from locking onto him. Both are qualities that Lawson lacks which is why he's used more-so in space than in the backfield.

I wouldn't be surprised at all if Maybin is the second DE/OLB taken, and Brown drops to the late first/early second round.

[Grigga2122]

If we draft Orakpo i would leave him at DE i wouldnt mess with what he is and try him at OLB.

[SING'S BOXERS]

yea but not 90% of players in the draft. Most juniors that declare are projected in the first 3 rounds. If you're a junior and dont project in the first three rounds(a la glenn coffee..whos making a big mistake by the way)..you better stay in school.

ok you and Cookie are right, my bad.

But the essence of my argument is that just because a player comes out early doesn't mean they have "character issues". That's a pretty ridiculous generalization.

[SING'S BOXERS]

If we draft Orakpo i would leave him at DE i wouldnt mess with what he is and try him at OLB.

what???? as a 3-4 DE???? :spit:

[Grigga2122]

So your gunna tell me Ray Macdonald can get to the QB better?

[Gof the Gij]

So your gunna tell me Ray Macdonald can get to the QB better?

Learn how the 34 works please.

[beasley for pres]

If we draft Orakpo i would leave him at DE i wouldnt mess with what he is and try him at OLB.

You want your 3-4 DE's to be at least 275. A 3-4 OLB is pretty much a 4-3 DE who is allowed to roam a little more.

[Grigga2122]

its not all about blitzing linebackers it would be nice to get pressure from the front 3..
P.s Cut your **** hair u look like an *******

[beasley for pres]

its not all about blitzing linebackers it would be nice to get pressure from the front 3..
P.s Cut your **** hair u look like an *******

Rak would get swallowed whole as a 3-4 DE.

[Gof the Gij]

its not all about blitzing linebackers it would be nice to get pressure from the front 3..
P.s Cut your **** hair u look like an *******

:slap:

Let's take a look at some 34 teams.

Chargers:
DE's: Olshansky, Castillo
OLB's: Merriman, Phillips

Who pressures the QB more?

Steelers:
DE's: Smith, Keisel
OLB's: Harrison, Woodley

Who pressures the QB more?

Cowboys:
DE's: Canty, Spears
OLB's: Ware, Ellis

Who pressures the QB more?

Dolphins:
DE's: Holliday, Langford
OLB's: Porter, Roth

Who pressures the QB more?

Exactly. Now let the big kids talk and go play with your toys.

[Max_Power]

:slap:

Let's take a look at some 34 teams.

Chargers:
DE's: Olshansky, Castillo
OLB's: Merriman, Phillips

Who pressures the QB more?

Steelers:
DE's: Smith, Keisel
OLB's: Harrison, Woodley

Who pressures the QB more?

Cowboys:
DE's: Canty, Spears
OLB's: Ware, Ellis

Who pressures the QB more?

Dolphins:
DE's: Holliday, Langford
OLB's: Porter, Roth

Who pressures the QB more?

Exactly. Now let the big kids talk and go play with your toys.

It's a shame it had to come to this.

[SBbound49ers]

This is where the fail pic goes.

[SING'S BOXERS]

It's a shame it had to come to this.

:nothingtoadd:

[Max_Power]

Weight is also an issue for another underclassman 'tweener, Everette Brown of Florida State. Some teams wonder if Brown has the body at this point to withstand the rigors of a 16-plus game season. In his final game at FSU, Brown weighed 225 pounds. Teams want their edge pass rushers to be around 260 pounds. This is an issue with which the 49ers are already familiar. They drafted Manny Lawson in the first round three years ago and the lanky linebacker has had a hard time adding weight - and explosiveness - to his frame.

http://www.sacbee.com/static/weblogs/49ers/archives/019502.html

[Max_Power]

Wow... 250 lbs is already pretty light for a 3-4 OLB as it is, 225 is flat out unacceptable. Hell, that's light for a Tampa 2 OLB.

I think Orakpo is the safer pick between the 2 right now. The Vernon Gholston comparison stops at the physique... Orakpo was a beast every time I saw him play in college, and has much more of a mean streak and natural pass rushing ability than Gholston did.

I just hope 'Po Boy isn't a juice monkey that's already maxed out his physical traits.

I agree with everything you said. I'm not crazy about drafting a PR at #10, but if we had to, I wouldn't mind Orakpo at all. Everyone else though, I have a little bit of issues with.

[SB49er4life]

http://www.sacbee.com/static/weblogs/49ers/archives/019502.html

Wow... 250 lbs is already pretty light for a 3-4 OLB as it is, 225 is flat out unacceptable. Hell, that's light for a Tampa 2 OLB.

I think Orakpo is the safer pick between the 2 right now. The Vernon Gholston comparison stops at the physique... Orakpo was a beast every time I saw him play in college, and has much more of a mean streak and natural pass rushing ability than Gholston did.

I just hope 'Po Boy isn't a juice monkey that's already maxed out his physical traits.

[SB49er4life]

I agree with everything you said. I'm not crazy about drafting a PR at #10, but if we had to, I wouldn't mind Orakpo at all. Everyone else though, I have a little bit of issues with.

Hindsight being 20/20, if Shawne Merriman is there at our #10 pick, I think it's a no-brainer regardless of who else is on the board. The thing is, I'm not completely sold on any of these guys as being THAT dominant at the next level.

Is Orakpo a 1-man game changer in the NFL? If he is, like I said... no brainer. A dominant pass rusher would do leaps and bounds more for this team than a dominant RT, that can be found in later rounds.

[ManCans]

Man, Brown is falling like a rock! Mayock just dropped him out of his top-5 OLB rankings altogether.

[xcfan]

Hindsight being 20/20, if Shawne Merriman is there at our #10 pick, I think it's a no-brainer regardless of who else is on the board. The thing is, I'm not completely sold on any of these guys as being THAT dominant at the next level.

Is Orakpo a 1-man game changer in the NFL? If he is, like I said... no brainer. A dominant pass rusher would do leaps and bounds more for this team than a dominant RT, that can be found in later rounds.

true hindsight would see that the college and early nfl merriman was beastly good because he was juiced.

if you have a keen eye for performance-enhanced bodies, you'll notice merriman no longer has a supernatural musculature, and is less of a player.
10-20 lbs of additional muscle on an elite athlete makes a world of difference.

[kavaholic]

everette brown is an amazing pass rusher with so much potential. i dont see us passing him up at #10.

[SB49er4life]

Hindsight being 20/20, if Shawne Merriman is there at our #10 pick, I think it's a no-brainer regardless of who else is on the board. The thing is, I'm not completely sold on any of these guys as being THAT dominant at the next level.

Is Orakpo a 1-man game changer in the NFL? If he is, like I said... no brainer. A dominant pass rusher would do leaps and bounds more for this team than a dominant RT, that can be found in later rounds.

true hindsight would see that the college and early nfl merriman was beastly good because he was juiced.

if you have a keen eye for performance-enhanced bodies, you'll notice merriman no longer has a supernatural musculature, and is less of a player.
10-20 lbs of additional muscle on an elite athlete makes a world of difference.

It's not as easy to tell a juiced body from a natural specimen as you think. Not all steroids are used to make guys "huge". Some guys are obvious, but again, not all PED's have the same effect on your physique.

Besides that, Merriman was beastly even AFTER he got caught with the sauce. Even then, I saw a pic of him with his shirt off before he got caught, and he actually looked just a lean, big dude.

[doublediamond]

frankly, there is no "sure thing" at ten...go heavy weight, Raji to lessen the odds IMO. ThenDavis in second to sit a year or two, try sometning different, LOL

[CeeBeeKay]

If anyone has seen Brown's highlights, and not believe that he's anything less than a human sack machine, you gotta be NUTS!!!! Brown will be the next great pass rusher in this league.

[xcfan]

which guy can cover? which guy can shed a block and stone a ball carrier?

gotta be a 3-down guy.

[Max_Power]

which guy can cover? which guy can shed a block and stone a ball carrier?

gotta be a 3-down guy.

I don't see either one being that guy.

[grod49]

I like Osackpo but I also like English as well, but at this time English isn't a top 10 pick and Osackpo is so I would take Osackpo with our 1st round pick. Unless English starts to workout really well and jumps up boards, then I would go with Osackpo.