A very early offseason plan

[rcs15]

Hey guys, my first post ever here. I'm a huge niner fan, but I follow a lot of college football also(Cal in particular). Having seen our team thus far it should be clear to everyone that the ENTIRE defense needs an upgrade. We have well over $20 million in cap room, so in theory we should be able to sign 2-3 quality players. Not necessarily the huge names like Lance Briggs or Nate Clements, but guys who are young and can be players in Nolan's system. Here's what I would do:

Sign: Asante Samuels (5 yr 22 million)
Ken Hamlin (5 yr 18 million)

Resign: BY(1 yr deal)
Hicks(3yr 2 million)

Draft:

1. Laron Landry, FS LSU
My favorite defensive player in CFB. I think he'd be a HUGE pickup for the awful secondary. He'd be an instant starter and would add some much needed speed and awareness to the secondary.

2. Brandon Mebane, DT Cal
I think he can learn some GREAT things under BY. He has great pass rushing skills for a DT, and we can move him to DE in the 3-4. He's not just a fat tub of lard, he's got skills. Definite upgrade over Douglas! Him and Oliver as the DE of the future!

3a). Desmond Bishop, ILB Cal
I love Desmond Bishop. I think he has great instincts to the ball and is an extremely sound tackler. He's a leader on Cal's defense and would make a great backup/replacement for smith or Ulbrich. He does get caught out of position sometimes b/c of overpursuit but that can be fixed. I thought he might last til round 4 a couple weeks ago, but he's been ON FIRE lately. I seriously doubt he's not a day 1 pick. We NEED to get him. And after his 16 tackle and one INT game against UW, him lasting to the third might not even be likely anymore.

3b). Brian Smith, OLB Missouri
Brian Smith is a DE in college, but I think we can move him to OLB in our system. He's 6-4 235 lbs and he's a good pass rusher! He's a lot like Haralson, but a better pass rusher. 15 sacks in two seasons, and I think him and Lawson can wreak havoc for years to come.

4a). Tim Duckworth, guard Auburn
I think with Allen's career obviously coming to an end and Newberry all but retired a guard is needed. It's always good to have some depth on the O-Line and Duckworth adds that. He's huge(6-3 320) and has the mauler type attitude I like in O-lineman. He's NOT terribly athletic, but I like him in Norv's offense. We can use Smiley in sweep or stretch plays and Duckworth on short yardage and goalline situations.

4b). Dwayne Bowe, WR LSU
I think Bryant has come into his own this season, but I'm still not sold on Battle or Gilmore being the #2 guy full time. Bowe is a big reciever(6-3 220) and has solid speed(around 4.5). I can see him being the #2 reciever once he developes in a few years.

4c). Fred Bennett, CB South Carolina
We already "signed" Samuels, and have Spencer but we have little else. Harris is at the end of his career and Sammy Davis sucks. Bennett can learn under Harris, and be our #4 corner. He has great physical ability and has played great competition week in and week out(important imo when looking at a player).

5. Mickey Pimental, OLB Cal
Great speed and hands for a LB. He's on the small side, but he's gotten bigger since he's been at Cal. I can easily see him bulking up to 230 ish, and being a great 3-4 OLB. Reminds me of Larry Foote.

6. Michael Johnson, FS Arizona
This late in the draft, I personally like to draft on potential. At 6-2 200 lbs Johnson has all the physicaly ability to play safety. Hes got enough speed to get by, and could blossom into a very solid backup with time. Better then Adams or Roman imo.

7. Dan Moses, center WVU
I think that with Newberry all but retired we need to draft for some depth at center. Heitmann is the starter, but I think if we can draft Moses that he would make an athletic backup. You know playing in the spread he probably can move a bit. This also frees Baas to focus strictly on playing guard!


QB: Smith/Dilfer/Hill
RB: Gore/Robinson/Hicks
FB: Norris/Hetherington
TE: Davis/Walker/Bajema
WR: Bryant/Battle/*Dwayne Bowe/Gilmore/Williams

LT: Jennings/Estas
LG: Allen/Baas
OC: Heitmann/*Moses
RG: Smiley/Wragge/*Duckworth
RT: Snyder/Harris

LE: BY/Oliver
NT: Sopoaga/Adams/Fields
RE: *Mebane/Douglas

OLB: Lawson/Haralson
ILB: Smith/Moore
ILB: *Bishop/Ulbrich
OLB: *Brian Smith/*Pimental/Slaughter

CB: Spencer/*Bennett/Davis
CB: Samuel*/Harris
FS: Hamlin*/*Michael Johnson
SS: Landry*/Hudson/Lewis




Now, it's very early so I don't know exactly if these guys will be around where I predicted. I did my best to guess, but you never know.

I also guessed on the compensation pick we're getting from JP. I think the Bryant signing cancels out the compensation we would have gotten from Carter leaving(again not sure just a guess).

That would be my ideal scenario. Not saying it's likely, but it would definitely mae the defense respectable. And with the offense growing like it is the future is extremely bright.

PLEASE, feel free to point out any flaws or critics in my thinking.

[MisfitZ]

if we take a DT in the second it will be Amobi Okoye Mebane isnt all that

[Triple Threat]

I would love it if we were able to get Landry. ALso like the offseason aquisitions that we would make.

[majesstik1]

I think Bowe will go in the second based on his physical stature, and his ability to dominate most corners (except DI :smile:).

The rest looks fine.

[majesstik1]

Is he a FA? I didn't see anything about that, but if he is I would expect SD to do everything they can to keep him. He was having a pro bowl year before his calf injury.

He's an RFA, so we'd have to pony up a pick (or two ) to snare him.

[majesstik1]

I'm kinda hoping he gets lost in the shuffle this year because of the deep WR class.

With guys like:
Johnson
Ginn
Jarrett
Samardzija
Sidney Rice
Paul Williams
Jason Hill
Steve Smith

That's an awfully deep class. Hopefully Bowe can slip to round 3 or 4 so we can grab him.

But you're right, he does have great tools. Wouldn't surprise me if he went in the second.

I don't think Rice is coming out (or at least it would be unwise for him to). He's struggled big time against slightly above average corners this year, and his value would be better if he stayed in school. But, those SC kids can't stay in school for the life of them, so he'll probably declare.

IMO, Bowe > Rice for the NFL game.

Also, you should add Robert Meachem to your list of WRs, he's ballin this year. Limas Sweed has good NFL tangibles as well.

Currently, Bowe has a 2nd Rd grade, but the list I have only includes seniors, so he may slip into the top of the third.

[ManCans]

Yeah, I've heard a lot about Okoye. Suppose to be ideal for a NT in the 3-4(by that I mean 6-1 ish, 320 lbs). And I think he's only 19 or 20, so he'll get bigger. That would be a great pickup also.Okoye might be the right size for a NT, but he's a one gap defensive tackle who gets good penetration and can stunt very well. I don't know why some think he'd be an ideal NFL NT, because that's not how he plays. He'd probably be much better in a Tampa 2 type scheme.

[Viper]

RCS 15--Welcome to the Board. I thought that was a thoughtful first post. In addition to being a fan of the Niners since Kezar days, I am also a Cal alum and attend quite a few Bear games. I am also impressed with Mebane and think he would be a good fit.

[VaSfan4life]

Sweed is my choice for a mid round steal. But we need a pass rusher(DE or OLB), a corner and a safety. Not in that order but close to it. Pass rush and DB's then a goood #2 WR like Sweed

[Pound th' Rock]

Here's my plan:

Free Agency -

Sign - Adalius Thomas, DE/OLB
Sign - Ken Hamlin, FS

Draft:

Trade up so as to get an additional 1st round pick.

1a) Patrick Willis, ILB (Ole Miss)
1b) Daymeion Hughes, CB (Cal)

I could rattle off another 20 players but right now, I don't feel like making a mock.

[JL 103]

I don't think Rice is coming out (or at least it would be unwise for him to). He's struggled big time against slightly above average corners this year, and his value would be better if he stayed in school. But, those SC kids can't stay in school for the life of them, so he'll probably declare.

IMO, Bowe > Rice for the NFL game.

Also, you should add Robert Meachem to your list of WRs, he's ballin this year. Limas Sweed has good NFL tangibles as well.

Currently, Bowe has a 2nd Rd grade, but the list I have only includes seniors, so he may slip into the top of the third.



All I can hope is that Meachum stays another year. but if he goes to the draft. I would love to see him in SF.

[ManCans]

Here's my plan:

Free Agency -

Sign - Adalius Thomas, DE/OLB
Sign - Ken Hamlin, FS

Draft:

Trade up so as to get an additional 1st round pick.

1a) Patrick Willis, ILB (Ole Miss)
1b) Daymeion Hughes, CB (Cal)

I could rattle off another 20 players but right now, I don't feel like making a mock.I think you've got it backwards. This is a very poor draft for linebackers, but it's a very good year for free agent linebackers. It's a very bad year for free agent defensive backs and 3-4 outside linebackers, but a very good draft class. When you go shopping, you go to the place with the best selection.

It would probably be best to draft a cornerback with our first overall pick who can come in and start right away. I think Leon Hall is the most NFL ready cornerback in the draft with tons of starting experience against top college competition. With our second pick, I think we should target Hall's teammate, Lamar Woodley, who's a team captain with 3-4 OLB written all over him, and pickup a safety with our third choice (possibly Meriweather). Of course, if we trade back up into the first round like we did last year, and Leron Landry is still available, I think we should select him and target a DE/OLB tweener (like Anthony Spencer) in the middle rounds.

In free agency, signing Thomas will be a longshot because he didn't like the restrictions placed on him in Mike Nolan's scheme, and will most likely re-sign with Baltimore. We'll probably try to sign NT Aubrayo Franklin and/or DE Jarret Johnson, whom Nolan drafted in Baltimore, or possibly a massive run stuffer like Terdell Sands. We might sign a cornerback and/or a safety, but I doubt we'll go after the bigger names out there. I think our best choice would be to re-sign Mark Roman and Chad Williams. The free agent market for safeties is horrible, and right now, ALL of the safeties on our roster will be either UFA (Parrish, Roman, Williams, Lewis) or RFA (Adams). As for linebackers, I think we should look at Patrick Chukwurah, Na'il Diggs, Barry Gardner, Gerald Hayes, E.J. Henderson, Cato June, Orlando Huff, D.D. Lewis, Kawika Mitchell, Anthony Peek, Scott Shanle, Brandon Short, Raonall Smith, Ben Taylor, and Nate Webster.

[9ersfan]

i don't think mozes will be going on the second day. Pretty sure he is ranked in the top 5 centers expected to out ot be drafted. I think he'll go higher. Duckworth is a great pick . Hughes is slated for a late 1st round or early second round, i would much rather get landry and then david irons later if we did go after a CB that early. Irons is a great cover corner for the tigers, i really like his skills. If hope do get Meacham, he is gross and is going to be a solid wide reciever.

[nolanlover]

we can always sign a younger OLB Shaun Phillips form SD
yea! that's exactly who i want. asante samuel and hamlin sound good as well.

[DeadlyNiners]

Nice first post man. Repped you.
That offseason plan sounds nice.

[majesstik1]

i like DI as well but he is already 24 years old. i wouldn't draft him until the 3rd because of his age. he may not contribute for a year or two like most draft picks and by that time a CB is going to start declining. i like DI alot on the field but at 24 he isn't worth a 2nd rounder.

That's the negative way to look at it.

At 24, he's got that much more experience and maturity. And, you typically sign your second rounders for 3, 4 years max. Age isn't a concern if the player has skills. DI has shown great shut down abilities this year, just ask Sydney Rice.

[majesstik1]

but he is still going to have to develop more to be successful in the NFL. despite his so called more maturity that your speculating on because none of us know him as a person, he will have to develop as a player to be successful in the NFL. and since he is already 24 i doubt he is going to develop much more. i really like DI but at most he will probably become a nickel or dime back simply because of his age and his skills wont develop in time before his bopdt starts slowing. since he is 24 now he will be 25 by next year which pretty much already cuts his career in half.

Nt Rly...

At 24, he's developed enough to step right in to a starting role for several NFL teams. This age debate is retarded. Why does 24 make him a bad prospect? Corners don't get into too much physical contact, so it's not like they all the sudden suck when they turn 30. There are several, and most good corners in the league right now, are in their 30s.

It's pretty much common knowledge that the more years you walk the earth, the more you understand the world, so his maturity level will be adjusted accordingly.

I laugh at the cut his career in half statement. Most guys come into the NFL at the age of 23. The average career lasts 3 years. He won't turn 25 until October 9th, so he's up a year and a half on the younger rookies. BFD, it won't dictate how long he plays.

One more thing to consider, DI has played several 1st round WRs, and other good prospects playing in the SEC. He's going to be fine when he gets to the pro level, stop pointing at age as a reason a player won't succeed, it's just stupid, really.

[majesstik1]

I'm not playing homer here, my views are completely objective.

I'll put it this way:

I'd rather have DI starting for us than any other corner we have, sans Spencer. And, there are several other teams in the same boat (CLE, NYJ, MIA, HOU, OAK, DET, NO-who has nothing but 30+ers, ARI, STL,) <---DI would be an upgrade over at least one starter for each of those teams.

DI is NFL ready, there's is no question. This year alone he's shut down Rice (4/48), Hill (who had a 2yd TD, but only 4 catches for 18 yards total), Bowe (4/56), and the Florida guys did little.

Honestly, age is not a factor. If you can get a 24 yr old who can play now, or a 22 yr old who needs a year and a half, you take the guy who's going to give you his best to start. Every player declines at different times. There are still elite CBs in the NFL that are past 30 (Ronde Barber, Brian Kelly, etc) and other guys just outside the elite that are still highly effective.

The average NFL career is 3 years, so if you get 6 out of DI before you have to move him to a nickle role (or to FS), you're getting just as good a deal as anything else.

Seriously, this age thing is horse business. A year and a half is not that big a deal.

If we had Spencer and DI, and we're able to acquire Rod Hood to play nickle for us, we've made a huge improvement in the secondary.

[BigB_85]

What about Walt Harris? No way would David Irons step in and start over him or Spencer.

I really doubt Irons as a rookie would be an upgrade over one starter for even one team in NFL, let alone 10. I think DI can develop into a good player, but you have to remember rookie DB's usually struggle a lot nad are burnt pretty often.

So I'd imagine him just playing in nickel/dime situations as a rookie.

[BigB_85]

Walt Harris will be lucky to have one more decent season past this year. He is ageing fast and you can't rely on someone near the end of their career to start for you very long. Not that I am saying the Niners should draft DI.. It isn't unlikely a rookie such as DI couldn't come in, fill in at nickle and special teams as a rookie.. then take over starting duties late season/next season. I don't know about starting but it is possible.
Walt Harris isn't the long-term solution obviously but he has been playing very good this season so I think it would be hard to unseat him. It would be nice to sign a veteran CB to add depth or draft one to groom for when Harris retires/leaves.

[9ersfan]

"true" cover corners coming out of college have a good probability of contributing early, expecially one with DI's talent and experience with top end talent. He might not be as fast a mccauley or hall, but he makes up for it in technique. I wouldn't mind having any of these corners, but Hall has really only excelled in zone from what i have seen, of course i don't Michigan too intently. But, i do watch auburn and irons ,from what i have seen, is much more polished and so far is THE lockdown corner out of the 4 or 5 top cornerbacks right now, in mind. He could contribute right away whether he started or played in nickle/dime coverages. But, again it really doesn't matter who we get, any of these guys could and would help us.

[9ersfan]

you really don't understand how ignorant your age comment is do you? Most players usually come out between the ages of 22-24, for the simple reason of being redshirted and stock piled away in their coaches talent pool. For the most part these 20 21 year old corner backs that declare for the draft end up gone out of the league, they are the ones that are in the "revolving 3 year careers, because of their inexperienceat the college level holding them back in the pros. The only one that really excel are the exceptionall physically gifted ones. In no way does his age have anything to do with his draft position. He is not as fast as the most of the other CB's (hughes, mccauley, hall) and is not as big either. If anything affects his draft status it will be his size not age. Most NFL team want bigger cornerbacks, but they think "if they're not big, they better be real fast"....in DI's case neither is true, but his technique is superior to these other CB's (don't try to argue this, it is widely accepted fact throughout the college football world and he just shuts people down), i.e. "true cover corner" and would be the first cornerback taken if he had halls size and speed. The only knock on him is lack of elite speed and size, size issue could definitely come into play with our team since we can't tackle for ****. But in no way does him being over a year older than the other CB's have anything to do with his draft position, that is just the most retarded thing i have ever heard and it sounds like something coming from a Madden player. "Oh No, i picked a CB that is 24 yrs old, time to trade him to the Texans for their 1st rounder in '08." Or maybe you could try trading him and kwame for andre johnson. :ohsnap: :tung:

[majesstik1]

What about Walt Harris? No way would David Irons step in and start over him or Spencer.

I really doubt Irons as a rookie would be an upgrade over one starter for even one team in NFL, let alone 10. I think DI can develop into a good player, but you have to remember rookie DB's usually struggle a lot nad are burnt pretty often.

So I'd imagine him just playing in nickel/dime situations as a rookie.

Walt Harris is on his last legs IMO. He's playing great for us now, but I wonder what level he'll be at next year.

DI would be an improvement over: Will Allen (MIA), Justin Miller (NYJ), Daylon McCutcheon (CLE), Lewis Sanders (HOU), Nnamdi Asomugha (OAK), Fernando Bryant (DET), Fred Thomas (NO), David "Toast" Macklin and Antrel "Where's my WR?" Rolle (ARI), and Travis Fisher (STL).

He'd also take over the starting role for us some time next year if we didn't add anything else in the offseason. If we got Hood, they'd compete for that spot, which would be a huge improvement for us.

The thing with DI is you don't have to teach him how to cover, he already knows. The younger/faster corners are athletically gifted, but those are the guys you're thinking of when you mention rookies getting beat. Look what Denver did last year with Williams and Foxworth, they drafted skilled players, and not for size/speed/age, and it paid off for them.

The thing you could argue about DI is what team will draft him based on their defensive scheme. A 'Man' defense will value him higher than a 'Zone'. You can trust DI to take care of his WR alone, and focus safety help elsewhere. Ultimately, that will decide his fate on draft day, not age.

[BigB_85]

Walt Harris is on his last legs IMO. He's playing great for us now, but I wonder what level he'll be at next year.

DI would be an improvement over: Will Allen (MIA), Justin Miller (NYJ), Daylon McCutcheon (CLE), Lewis Sanders (HOU), Nnamdi Asomugha (OAK), Fernando Bryant (DET), Fred Thomas (NO), David "Toast" Macklin and Antrel "Where's my WR?" Rolle (ARI), and Travis Fisher (STL).

He'd also take over the starting role for us some time next year if we didn't add anything else in the offseason. If we got Hood, they'd compete for that spot, which would be a huge improvement for us.

The thing with DI is you don't have to teach him how to cover, he already knows. The younger/faster corners are athletically gifted, but those are the guys you're thinking of when you mention rookies getting beat. Look what Denver did last year with Williams and Foxworth, they drafted skilled players, and not for size/speed/age, and it paid off for them.

The thing you could argue about DI is what team will draft him based on their defensive scheme. A 'Man' defense will value him higher than a 'Zone'. You can trust DI to take care of his WR alone, and focus safety help elsewhere. Ultimately, that will decide his fate on draft day, not age.

I'll give Walt the benefit of the doubt. Harris has been playing very well this season so I don't really see why he couldn't do it again next season. He is aging and the team should groom a younger CB (or sign a veteran) to take over by the 2008 season.

I also doubt Irons would be an immediate improvement over any of the CB's named. He could be over time though, maybe learning on the bench for a year. Most of those guys aren't that great at all but Nnamdi Asomugha is part of an impressive Raider defense. Also, I don't even think David Macklin starts. Maybe it says that on the NFL.com depth chart but those are inaccurate all the time. From the games I have seen I'm pretty sure Eric Green has been the Cards starting CB opposite Rolle.

DI may be more NFL ready than some of the more athletic guys like McCauley, however, that doesn't mean there isn't a learning curve. You also have to consider rookie DB's are burnt quite often, so if DI was starting as a rookie I think he'd be burnt to a crisp.

[nolanlover]

Seriously, this age thing is horse business.

so much for that overly used excuse for alex smith. "alex is only 22, one of the youngest QBs in the league!"

[majesstik1]

DI may be more NFL ready than some of the more athletic guys like McCauley, however, that doesn't mean there isn't a learning curve. You also have to consider rookie DB's are burnt quite often, so if DI was starting as a rookie I think he'd be burnt to a crisp.

A major part of the learning curve is learning proper technique, which DI already has. The only thing he'd have to learn (as would any player new to a team) is the defensive scheme.

If he started as a rookie, I'd bet he held his own better than many veterans. CBs get burnt all the time, it has nothing to do with their experience level. Heck, even Champ Bailey looked more the part of Chump Bailout in 2004, and was absolutely horrendous that season.

Saying someone will get burnt to a crisp is a lame blanket statement that you could use a single play to prove your point. If a CB plays great coverage, and perhaps allows a catch or two, but is immediately there to make the tackle is plenty good for most employers. When you get a guy who thinks he can make a highlight reel play for the ball and whiffs only to see his man walking into the end-zone, and doesn't learn their lesson, those are the guys behind the learning curve, those are the guys getting burnt to a crisp.

DI is not going to be 'that guy'. He doesn't get many picks because he's focused on stopping the play, not playing risky coverage, and not giving his man an opportunity for the QB to throw to him. I'd rather have the guy knocking the ball out, or putting a good hit on a WR immediately after catching an 8 yard pass over a Phillip Buchanon type.

[BigB_85]

A major part of the learning curve is learning proper technique, which DI already has. The only thing he'd have to learn (as would any player new to a team) is the defensive scheme.

If he started as a rookie, I'd bet he held his own better than many veterans. CBs get burnt all the time, it has nothing to do with their experience level. Heck, even Champ Bailey looked more the part of Chump Bailout in 2004, and was absolutely horrendous that season.

Saying someone will get burnt to a crisp is a lame blanket statement that you could use a single play to prove your point. If a CB plays great coverage, and perhaps allows a catch or two, but is immediately there to make the tackle is plenty good for most employers. When you get a guy who thinks he can make a highlight reel play for the ball and whiffs only to see his man walking into the end-zone, and doesn't learn their lesson, those are the guys behind the learning curve, those are the guys getting burnt to a crisp.

DI is not going to be 'that guy'. He doesn't get many picks because he's focused on stopping the play, not playing risky coverage, and not giving his man an opportunity for the QB to throw to him. I'd rather have the guy knocking the ball out, or putting a good hit on a WR immediately after catching an 8 yard pass over a Phillip Buchanon type.

Ok so saying "He will get burnt to a crisp" might not be the best way too put it, but I think it is fair to say he will struggle quite a bit, just like almost all rookie DB's do.

Just because he doesn't go for the interception, risking giving up the big play doesn't mean he can start right away. Like you said, maybe he has better technique than other guys but it can still be improved upon. Plus, he would have to learn the terminology/scheme and to read NFL offenses.

[A187]

thx for the good first post rcs15, and the effort you put in. rep to you as well

:welcome2: